Monday is a Travel Day

“We’re heading to Evans Head in Northern NSW tomorrow for a couple of weeks of relaxation and day trips to spots like Yamba and other nearby towns. Over the course of our stay, seven fellow veterans and their wives will be joining us—representing 105 Field Battery, 35 Squadron RAAF, 6RAR, and 1RAR. There will be daily happy hours and plenty of tall stories. If you’re in the area, we’d love for you to join us!”

Cheers Ray & Julie

North Korean Soldiers Reportedly Desert Russian Frontline as Search Intensifies

According to South Korea’s National Intelligence Service (NIS), as of October 18, around 12,000 North Korean troops have already been deployed to Ukraine. Yonhap, a prominent South Korean news agency, reported that the NIS has confirmed North Korea’s direct involvement in the conflict, with an estimated 1,500 soldiers being transported between October 8 and 13 in the first phase of deployment.

Approximately 18 North Korean soldiers have allegedly deserted their posts on the Russian frontline, prompting an ongoing search by Kremlin forces. The soldiers, deployed near the Russian regions of Kursk and Bryansk—roughly four miles from the Ukrainian border—reportedly abandoned their positions, according to Ukraine’s public broadcaster, Suspilne.

Citing intelligence sources, Suspilne revealed that Russian commanders are working to track down the missing troops while attempting to hide the desertion from higher authorities. This incident comes on the heels of reports suggesting that Russia is assembling a North Korean battalion, sent by Kim Jong Un, to bolster efforts to repel Ukrainian forces from the Kursk region.

Ukrainian media outlet LIGA reported on October 16 that the North Korean troops were expected to engage in combat operations in Russia’s southwestern regions, where fighting with Ukrainian forces remains intense. The soldiers were reportedly slated to join a “special Buryat battalion,” named after the Buryat people, a Mongolic ethnic group native to Siberia, northern Mongolia, and China.

M1A2 SEPv3 Abrams puts in maiden Australian appearance

by Gordon Arthur, Melbourne

The heaviest piece of equipment showcased at Land Forces 2024 was the M1A2 SEPv3 Abrams main battle tank, recently shipped from California to Australia. This freshly arrived tank, bearing the serial number ‘277002’, travelled from the port to the exhibition centre. It featured a Kongsberg CROWS-Low Profile weapon station, marking the first time Australian Abrams commanders could operate a machine gun from within the safety of the tank’s armoured protection. The initial delivery to Australia reportedly includes 27 of these tanks.

While the featured Abrams lacked the Trophy active protection system (APS), it is designed to accommodate future installations of Rafael’s system. Lt. Gen. Simon Stuart, Chief of the Army, confirmed this during a recent update. Notably, these tanks combine newly built turrets with refurbished hulls, a strategic decision by the Australian Army. Weighing in at 66 tonnes when fully loaded for combat, the M1A2 SEPv3 is around five tonnes heavier than the previously operated M1A1 AIM tanks, largely due to enhanced armour protection. In fact, the exhibition floor beneath the tank had to be specially reinforced to support its weight.

Australia is acquiring 75 M1A2 SEPv3 tanks through Project Land 907, a combined effort that integrates Phase 2 of Project Land 907 (Abrams tanks) and Phase 1 of Project Land 8160. The latter includes 29 M1150 Assault Breacher Vehicles (ABV), 17 M1074 Joint Assault Bridges (JAB), and six additional M88A2 armoured recovery vehicles. These advanced armoured units will primarily serve the 2nd Cavalry Regiment of the 3rd Brigade, based in Townsville, following a recent army-wide restructure focusing heavy armour within this brigade, as outlined in last year’s Defence Strategic Review.

Later this year, the new Abrams tanks will be delivered to the School of Armour in Puckapunyal, with deployments to Townsville planned for 2025. The ABVs and JABs are scheduled to arrive at the 3rd Combat Engineer Regiment starting around March 2025. Additionally, six more M88A2 HERCULES recovery vehicles from BAE Systems will join Australia’s fleet, bringing the total number of these support vehicles to 19.

Despite growing concerns about the relevance of main battle tanks in modern warfare, where antitank missiles and loitering munitions are becoming more common, the Australian Army maintains that the M1A2 SEPv3 remains a critical asset. The army describes the tank as “highly lethal, survivable, networked, and manoeuvrable,” with capabilities that no other platform can match in terms of firepower, protection, mobility, and situational awareness.

Picture by Gordon Arthur 

Hamas Leader’s Death Sparks Tensions

The Krakow Post

The recent assassination of Yahya Sinwar, a high-ranking Hamas leader, has intensified tensions in the ongoing conflict between Hamas and Israel. Sinwar, who played a significant role in obstructing cease-fire talks and hostage negotiations, was killed on Wednesday, a move confirmed by senior Hamas official Khalil al-Hayya. His death has raised questions about the fate of the hostages Hamas has taken, with many wondering if their release is imminent. However, Hamas has made it clear that the death of their leader will not soften their stance.

Despite Sinwar’s assassination, Hamas continues to refuse any release of the 101 remaining hostages unless their demands are met. These include a full cease-fire and a complete Israeli withdrawal from contested areas. While many had hoped that Sinwar’s death might lead to a breakthrough in negotiations, Hamas remains firm in its defiance, refusing to show any signs of compromise.

Hamas has been quick to condemn the assassination, vowing that Sinwar’s death will only strengthen their resolve. The organization claims that killing one of its top leaders will fuel their fight against Israel, not weaken it. Senior leaders of Hamas have reaffirmed their commitment to their goals and insist that the violence will continue.

In the aftermath of Sinwar’s death, Hamas and its supporters have rallied around his legacy. The group’s Western supporters have taken to social media platforms, portraying him as a martyr and war hero. This online idolization has further polarized global perspectives on the conflict, with many in the West praising Sinwar’s actions, while others condemn the glorification of violence and terrorism.

Sinwar’s death has undoubtedly escalated an already volatile situation, and with Hamas refusing to negotiate on the return of hostages, the road to peace seems more distant than ever. As tensions mount, the future of the conflict remains uncertain.

The Battle at Milne Bay – RAAF Memories of a Pivotal WWII Battle

The Battle of Milne Bay (from August 25 through to September 7, 1942), was the defence of the eastern New Guinea by Australian and US forces against a Japanese invasion. It would become the first time that Japanese forces had been defeated on land, shattering the myth at the time of Japanese invincibility. The Royal Australian Air Force played a particularly important role in this battle, maintaining air superiority over the region and inflicting serious damage to invading forces.

The US Air Force Deploys B-2 Spirit Bombers to Strike Iran-Backed Houthi Targets

The U.S. Air Force has deployed its B-2 Spirit bombers to strike Iran-backed Houthi targets in Yemen, marking the aircraft’s first combat operation since 2017. This is not just any ordinary military mission; it sends a clear and powerful message to Iran and its proxies in the region.

The B-2 bombers were tasked with targeting hidden underground weapons facilities used by Houthi forces in Yemen. These strikes were launched in response to a series of attacks by the Houthis on civilian and military vessels in the region. Defence Secretary Lloyd Austin highlighted the precision and strength of U.S. military capabilities, noting that the U.S. can strike deeply buried targets with formidable force. This operation underscores America’s resolve to protect its interests in the region and prevent further Houthi aggression.

This deployment of B-2 bombers sends a significant signal to Iran and its allied forces. Retired Air Force Col. Mark Gunzinger emphasized that while the Houthis were the direct target, the underlying message is for Tehran. The U.S. demonstrated not only its ability but also its willingness to utilize high-end military assets when necessary. The presence of B-2s, which are rarely deployed in combat, elevates the gravity of the situation and reflects the strategic importance of the mission.

The last time B-2 bombers were used in combat was in 2017 when they conducted a 33-hour mission to Libya, targeting and eliminating approximately 100 Islamic State militants. Since the B-2 Spirit became operational in the mid-1990s, it has been one of the most advanced and lethal aircraft in the U.S. Air Force’s arsenal. With a payload of 40,000 pounds, the stealth bomber can carry both conventional and nuclear weapons, making it a critical asset in high-stakes missions like this one.

As the B-2 continues to serve its vital role in U.S. defence strategy, the Air Force is already looking toward the future. The new B-21 Raider bomber, currently in-flight testing, is expected to replace the B-2 and other older bombers. The Department of Defence has plans to acquire around 100 B-21 bombers, each priced at approximately $700 million. These next-generation aircraft will further enhance the U.S.’s ability to conduct long-range, precision-strike operations.

This latest deployment of the B-2 Spirit demonstrates that the U.S. is not backing down in its efforts to curb Iran’s influence in the region, signalling that American military power remains a potent force on the world stage.

It Finally Happened: The Day Israelis Have Long Awaited Has Arrived

CNN Report

Israeli forces have achieved a major victory by eliminating Yahya Sinwar, the Hamas leader responsible for the brutal October 7, 2023, attack. While this marks a significant milestone in Israel’s ongoing struggle, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has cautioned that the conflict is far from over, with the pressing issue of hostages still unresolved.

Quick Summary of the Operation

Over the past few weeks, the 162nd Division and Gaza Division of the Israel Defence Forces (IDF) launched operations based on intelligence regarding the whereabouts of senior Hamas officials. The mission unfolded rapidly on Wednesday.

The Attack:

  • After three terrorists were spotted, two entered one building, while Sinwar entered another. At the time, the IDF was unaware that Sinwar was among them.
  • IDF tanks opened fire on both buildings.
  • Sinwar attempted to move to the second floor. A tank shell hit the building again, prompting an infantry search.
  • Sinwar retaliated with two grenades, one of which exploded, causing IDF forces to temporarily withdraw.
  • A drone scanned the area and found Sinwar injured, throwing a wooden stick at it.
  • A final tank shell was fired, killing him.

The Extraction:

Sinwar’s body was extracted and brought to Israel on Thursday, where DNA and other tests confirmed his identity. Due to the danger of the booby-trapped location, a portion of his finger was removed for quick testing.

Reactions

Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu has confirmed Sinwar’s death, emphasizing that while this is a significant achievement, the broader conflict, especially the freeing of hostages, continues.

Australian Defence Showcases Cutting-Edge Robotics and Autonomous Systems at Puckapunyal

Photo: Cpl Michael Currie

The Puckapunyal military area in Victoria became a hub of innovation as representatives from the defence industry, engineers, and Australian Defence Force personnel, including members of the 1st Armoured Regiment, gathered for the Land Autonomous Systems and Teaming Demonstration (LAST-D).

This event featured a range of advanced technologies, including the M113 optionally crewed combat vehicles, remotely operated platforms, and a remotely controlled mini-gun. These systems are part of the Australian Army’s drive to integrate robotics and autonomous technologies into their operations.

“LAST-D is Army’s capstone emerging technology event for 2024,” according to Defence. “It showcased a broad spectrum of technology under development within Defence and the broader defence industry.”

The demonstration is a key milestone in the Army’s ongoing commitment to its 2022 Robotic and Autonomous Systems (RAS) Strategy. This strategy aims to explore new ways to integrate human operators with intelligent machines through three core themes: intelligent machines, machine-to-machine teaming, and human-to-machine teaming.

Key benefits expected from RAS technology include:

  • Maximising soldier performance
  • Enhancing decision-making capabilities
  • Generating scalable effects and mass
  • Strengthening force protection
  • Improving operational efficiency

The event also highlighted various innovative systems, such as:

  • The Australian Army’s Hawkei vehicle, fitted with a 30mm remote weapon station
  • An optionally crewed combat vehicle, equipped with a remotely controlled mini-gun
  • OWL-B loitering munitions
  • Unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs)

These cutting-edge platforms aim to reduce human exposure to danger, improve battlefield performance, and enhance overall mission success. With the ongoing development and testing of these technologies, the Australian Defence Force is positioning itself as a leader in the use of autonomous systems on the battlefield.

This demonstration reflects the growing collaboration between Defence and the defence industry, working together to develop solutions that will shape the future of military operations in Australia.

 

Australian Maj. Gen. Richard Vagg on domestic weapons production and new vehicles

“What characterizes war, it’s a battle of will and magic bullets don’t exist. There is certainly a need for precision and really high-end weapon systems, but there’s also a need for mass, relatively inexpensive weapon systems.” Australian Maj. Gen. Vagg told Breaking Defence.

Maj. Gen. Richard Vagg spoke with Breaking Defence during the 2024 AUSA conference. (Australian Army)

WASHINGTON — America’s largest defence conference, the annual gathering of the Association of the US Army, brings in a reliable international presence for the conference, including a sizeable contingent from Australia. Among the top officials making the trip to Washington for the conference was Australian Army Maj. Gen. Richard Vagg, the service’s head of Land Capability, a role that sees him provide acquisition requirements for the service.

Vagg, who was the top military officer on Australia’s recent Defence Strategic Review, talked with Breaking Defence on the sidelines of the conference. Among the topics discussed: lessons of Ukrainian artillery, Boxer troop carrier production, the future of the Tiger ARH helicopter, the new Redback Infantry Fighting Vehicle and more.

The interview has been edited for length and clarity.

Breaking Defence: Let’s start with Boxer. How is that program progressing? 

MAJ. GEN. RICHARD VAGG: As you know, we’ve got our Block One vehicles in service now. We took delivery of the first Australian-built Boxer in July and we are working with the company (Rheinmetall Defence Australia) to work out what the drum beat of vehicles is going to be. … We’re expecting to receive the Boxer between now and 2028, 2029, over that period. 211 vehicles in total will be our Boxer fleet. Plus the 100 vehicles that we’re doing the government-to-government deal back into Germany with. [Australia is also building 100 Boxers to be exported to Germany.]

How many are you expecting to have by the end of the year?

I’m not sure at this stage.

Are you comfortable with everything being on track with Initial Operating Capability and Full Operating Capability?

I’m comfortable. We know we’ve got a really good capability.

What about the Redback Infantry Fighting Vehicles, made by Hanwha in Australia. I know it’s still early days, but how are you feeling about that? Any hiccups you’re seeing early?

No, we’re really pleased, actually, with the relationship that we’ve developed with Hanwha … You know, they’ve recently opened what’s called the Hanwha Armoured Centre of Excellence down in Geelong. That was opened ahead of time, below budget. So, all the indicators are there — like the facilities and building a factory is generally pretty difficult. So, enjoying working with Hanwha and they’ve really established themselves in Australia.

How’s that relationship developing? Hanwha has just kind of blown up the last couple of years in Australia, in a good way.

It’s been a really good relationship. It’s early days, yeah, so I don’t want to sit here and say it’s [always] going to be awesome, but all the indicators are really positive … What we hope is that actually establishes an ability to build an export base from Australia. If Hanwha can manage that, that would be really powerful.

What’s the plan for aviation as you bring down the Tiger ARH helicopters?

As you may well know, we’re replacing our Tiger fleet with AH-64 Apaches. So we expect to receive our first Apaches by Q4 next year. We’ll manage the phase out of the ARH capability Tiger with the introduction in the service of the Apaches. It’s important that we maintain that capability, and the way we’ll do that is, we currently have our attack aviation capability in Darwin. Apache will be delivered into Townsville. So, one aviation regiment will move from Darwin to Townsville, and as we introduce Apache, work up to an IOC capability, we’ll close down Darwin and the capability with Tiger.

What happens then to the Tigers?

We will provide options for government in terms of what they want us to do with Tiger, when it comes out of service — everything from contributing to the global supply fleet, there may be gifting options there. It’s probably too early to tell at this stage, and that’ll be a government decision.

Is there any military value in mothballing them, or does that just not make any sense for you?

Cost of ownership becomes problematic for us. It’s a really technical airframe here. It’s effectively, I don’t think it’s the technical term, but it’s like software defined radios. It’s a software defined air system. It’s not something you just lock in the shed and then roll it out at a later date.

You’re an artillery guy by training. Are there lessons that are coming out of Ukraine and to a lesser extent Gaza that you feel are being successfully incorporated into your planning, or is there not as much relevance to those takeaways, because it’s such a different situation in Australia?

There are some really strong lessons that are coming out of out of all those theatres you’ve mentioned. And I think it underpins that what characterizes war, it’s a battle of will and magic bullets don’t exist. There is certainly a need for precision and really high-end weapon systems, but there’s also a need for mass, relatively inexpensive weapon systems.

A few years ago, people were starting to draw down their stocks. Now you can’t buy 155 [shells] in the world, and we can’t produce enough 155s. You can’t produce enough propellant or explosive fill for those types of systems now. So, I think some of those hard learned lessons from last conflicts are definitely coming forward in terms of us drawing those lessons into our theatre, the Indo-Pacific, of what it means for us.

We as an army, need to be prepared to conduct close combat. And we need to have all the capabilities that come with close combat.

You mentioned 155s. How important is it for Australia to get a domestic capability for insensitive explosives?

I think our government’s been really clear. You just look at the investment they put into guided weapons and explosive ordnance in Australia. Air Marshal Leon Phillips is the chief of our Guided Weapons and Explosive Ordinance, very active in terms of establishing domestic capabilities. And look at some of the announcements that have been made recently in terms of the domestic production of NSM in Australia. I know we’re looking at 155; it’ll be crawl, walk, run. I don’t need to say it’s important — I think the government’s actions, the amount of money and effort they’ve invested in that area makes that pretty clear.

What about solid rocket motor production?

Again, that’s part of that ecosystem the GWEO group is starting to develop. We know some of the rate limiting factors to some of our long-range strike capabilities is access to motors.

So that’s something you think is important to have domestic production of?

Bloody oath it does. And I think there’s an active request for information with industry in terms of that capability being introduced into Australia, and how industry will go about dealing with that.

Obviously, AUKUS is the biggest military modernization effort facing Australia. Are you at all concerned or seeing signs at all that some land projects or land modernization efforts might get delayed, pushed back, underfunded because that money is needed to go towards AUKUS instead? 

No, and I’m cautious in doing that. Our National Defence Strategy and our Integrated Investment Program have looked across our force structure and have prioritized capabilities and investment in capabilities to have an integrated force, and we’re quite clear about not having an overly weighted force in one area. It’s about an integrated force, and an integrated force is one where the five domains are thought about and integrated before they hit the objective. An integrated force is about combining and integrating those effects well before the objective, and much like a stool, once you remove one of those legs, it becomes uneven and wobbly.

So, probably a long explanation, but you know, we’ve made some very, very considered decisions about our investment plans from a ADF perspective and are quite comfortable where we’re sitting in terms of our land projects.

Picture: An armed reconnaissance ‘Tiger’ helicopter from the 1st Aviation Regiment fires a Hellfire missile during Indo-Pacific Endeavour 2022. (Australian Ministry of Defence)

 

Homeless veterans deserve more than platitudes – they deserve results

Defence Connect – David Hollingworth

Vasey RSL Care wants government to meet it halfway to support homeless veterans – but Labor is ignoring its request.

The Royal Commission into Defence and Veteran Suicide went to great lengths to navigate the depth and intricacies of the problems facing ex-Defence personnel.

The executive summary alone is a weighty document, numbering almost 320 pages, and in its opening paragraphs reveals the scale of the effort undertaken: oral evidence from more than 340 witnesses and more than 60 lived witness experiences; 12 public hearings held over 100 days; 897 private, one-on-one sessions with people who have experienced the impact of suicide or lived with suicidality; and 5,865 submissions from current ex-ADF members, their carers and families and friends.

Which, sadly, adds up to even more – and even more tragic – numbers. Veterans are more than twice as likely to die by suicide than the rest of the Australian population. They’re also nearly three times more likely to experience homelessness, and that sense of abandonment only feeds into the suicide crisis facing our veterans.

The V Centre Veteran Empowerment Program, run in Victoria by not-for-profit Vasey RSL Care, wants to do something about the homelessness problem, but so far, it’s been used as a political crutch by the government and then left to fend for itself.

Giving veterans hope

The V Centre was established in Ivanhoe, Victoria, in February 2024, and boasts 16 complete apartments, three studios, communal kitchen and living spaces, and outdoor areas and places for quiet contemplation. An attached support hub provides IT services, consultation and therapy rooms, rec rooms, and other spaces.

The V Centre Veteran Empowerment Program operates out of The V Centre and offers programs to help empower veterans with the social skills they need to transition into a new and stable phase of their lives outside the defence force.

Setting up The V Centre cost Vasey RSL Care $12 million, and it had hopes that the government would front up a similar investment over the next three years. Vasey RSL Care estimates the total savings from its program as being more than $18 million in that three-year time frame, a worthwhile investment considering those savings also represent human lives.

Matt Keogh, the Minister for Veterans’ Affairs, certainly seemed to buy into the idea.

“I’ve been very pleased to meet with Vasey RSL Care from Victoria with the member for Jagajaga, who brought to my attention the important work they are trying to do in establishing new services to support veterans experiencing homelessness,” Keogh said in August 2023, speaking to a matter of public importance.

“They also want to be able to come forward and apply for funds from government, but we can’t enable that right now, because the Housing Australia Future Fund is being blocked by the Coalition and the Greens.”

So, at that point, it was the Greens blocking the government being able to support The V Centre.

Kate Thwaites, the member for Jagajaga and the Assistant Minister for Social Security, Ageing and Women, said a month later that the Housing Australia Future Fund “will also mean more homes for veterans at risk of homelessness and for services like Vasey RSL Care, which is doing brilliant work at The V Centre just next to Heidelberg Repat supporting veterans and their families but which could do even more with the right support from this fund”.

So, it was a love fest all around, and if it weren’t for those dastardly Greens, we’d be helping Vasey RSL Care right now.

Taking hope away

However, at the time, Vasey RSL Care was helping the government get its legislation through, working with both the crossbench and the opposition to get it passed. Once passed, however, the promises dried up. Vasey RSL Care was told that since it was already operating, it was no longer eligible for government assistance, despite the promises written into Hansard.

According to Janna Voloshin, chief executive officer at Vasey RSL Care, “We cannot sit around waiting for funding.”

“Enough is enough – last month, the Royal Commission into Defence and Veteran Suicide handed down its final report and recommendations. We are fully supportive of the recommendations, in particular, Recommendation 88a – ‘improving outcomes for veterans who are experiencing homelessness, including a long-term investment framework that supports capital and operational expenditure for veteran-specific housing and the provision of wraparound services’. We are here – we are doing this – we are saving lives. But we can’t go on doing it without government support.”

Which seems a fair thing to say – the lack of support for veterans, which in turn has led to the horrific suicide figures among our current and ex-Defence personnel, is a government problem to fix.

Defence Connect put this proposition directly to Minister Keogh, and to call the response underwhelming is … putting it politely.

“The rate of veteran suicide is a national tragedy, and that’s why Labor supported the establishment of the Royal Commission into Defence and Veteran Suicide in opposition,” Keogh said in response to Vasey RSL Care’s claims.

“Now, some three years and thousands of submissions later, the final report has now been delivered to the government.

“The report is an important body of work, which marks the culmination of the most significant and comprehensive inquiry conducted into suicide and suicidality in the Defence and veteran communities.”

The minister went on to talk about the government response, the comprehensive nature of the royal commission’s report, and… Failed to actually address Vasey RSL Care’s concerns over a lack of funding.

Not at all good enough

Defence Connect spoke to a Vasey RSL spokesperson and while it was impossible to coordinate commentary from Voloshin, its CEO, it was clear that Minister Keogh’s response – or lack thereof – was not particularly welcome nor constructive.

“While the royal commission’s role in listening to the concerns of the veteran community and making recommendations is crucial, we must remember that it took three years to reach this point. Following the government’s response, we may face several more years of implementation. In the meantime, veterans are waiting, and we continue to lose lives,” Voloshin told Defence Connect.

“At Vasey RSL Care, we have experienced these issues firsthand and chose not to wait for solutions to be formulated. Based on national and international research, extensive engagement with the ex-service community (including over 500 surveys and focus groups), we developed the model for The V Centre,” Voloshin said.

“While the royal commission was in process, we actively worked on a solution that we knew was necessary and since 2022, we have engaged with the government to ensure they were aware of this initiative.”

The V Centre and its accompanying veteran empowerment program are in operation now, and it’s already making a difference. A real difference to real veterans who need that support.

“The V Centre has just transformed me,” Shane Reynolds, who attended The V Centre, said of the program.

“It’s just amazing the things that I’ve done that I’ve never done before – my painting, my art … I’ve become a productive person again.

“I found through my art that I released a lot of my traumas. If it wasn’t for V, I don’t know where I’d be.”

It’s clear that Vasey RSL Care has a program that works – and it could do so much more with just a bit of support from the government.

“Previously, we relied on research to identify what was needed,” Voloshin said.

“Today, The V Centre has been operational for six months, demonstrating significant positive outcomes for veterans and giving us real-life examples of the impact a service like this can have.

“We urge the government to respond now with financial support for The V Centre, even if only in the short-term, until a comprehensive solution is established. Vasey RSL Care is only asking for three years of support from the government for an already well-researched model operating as a pilot study that can be thoroughly evaluated as to the benefit it has to veterans.”